Topic: My Spaghetti Show

[BlinkenLights]

well im glad that my input is useful, i often think im asking too much or just rambling...

[Fanny Pack]

Feel free to ask all you want.  It may take me a long time or I may never get around to what you ask for but I always like getting feedback.  Many of your ideas I have already thought about but I didn't necessarily think others would be interested in so I didn't put much weight on them.

I currently have a big list of things to work on.  Bugs are at the top.  Requests usually get pushed near the top unless they fit in my roadmap somewhere and I'll put them where they fit.  For example, I have plans to change the drivers around a lot and the live preview fits into that work so it fits in with that.  But for now, I have a lot of things to do with 1.8.x.  The show save confirmation will go in 1.8.xx.  Some of your other ideas are being pushed to 1.9.xx and I am not sure how long it will take to get there.

But, the bottom line is that if you don't ask then your chances of receiving are a lot less.  So go for it.

[meandean]

  For the unliscensed rev of Spaghetti, consider expanding it to include the ability to passively play back a show onscreen (no editing, re-prossesing or laser output); that way, liscensed users could post their work to a place like this Forum as demo material for what the program can produce without giving away the store. You might land new customers if they could get a sense of what Spaghetti is about.

[Fanny Pack]

Yea, I thought about doing that.  I might in the future.

[BlinkenLights]

playing shows is kinda important. If spaghetti free plays shows, then there is no reason for many to buy it.

LOTS of people buy pangolin systems and NEVER create content, just play others shows.

[meandean]

  As long as Laser output is disabled, VGA playback wouldn't give away too much...

[BlinkenLights]

oops sorry, miss read that..

[BlinkenLights]

Minor annoyances
the color level in the laser output setup.

i like the sliders but i would also like a text number that i can set for accuracy.

[Things]

That is a complicated subject and there is a little history behind it as far as Spaghetti is concerned.  I'll try to explain but you'll probably have to reread this a few times before it settles in.

The Frame Rate set for the Spaghetti project is how fast the DAC will be updated.   When an ILDA source is set to "Frame Based" modes, a new frame will be sent with each update.  This is basically like playing a film.  If the project frame rate doesn't match the speed of film the animation will appear to be to slow or fast.  "Frame Based" mode is what I initially started with in Spaghetti.  It was the only mode.  If I started over I would not have this mode and I have considered removing it.  In Time Based mode, you can stretch the ILDA file out or shrink it.  The DAC will still get updated at the project frame rate but if the ILDA file is stretched out twice as long as it has frames, each frame in the file will be sent to the DAC twice.  If the file is shrunk to 1/2 of the normal length, every other frame will be skipped.

If the source ILDA files have a large number of points per frame, the frame rate has to be low or else frames will be skipped.  This is because there is a limit to the number of points per second that the DAC can display.  If the DAC max is 30Kpps then if the frame has 6000 pts in it then the max frame rate is only 5FPS.  If the frame has 100 pts then the max frame rate is 300FPS.  So what do you pick?  Generally, if you leave it at 30 you will be OK.  There is a reason for bumping it up, though.  If you are doing something like beams shows with not too many points in them, specifying a higher frame rate will give you smoother effects.  You will be able to apply fast rotations to objects and they will appear to rotate smoothly instead of jerk.

hey Gary, so does that mean that with a lower FPS rate in Spaghetti, the output would be much more "jerky"? than if you set it to say 30FPS? Whats a good FPS for syncing with songs? I think this may have been the problem with my frames not maching up with the music What FPS rate do you typically use?

[Fanny Pack]

Yes, imagine a framerate of 1 frame per second.  You can't animate anything that slow.  You don't see fluid motion until you get to around 20 or so frames per second.  Movies are filmed at 24 frames per second.  TV is at 30 frames per second (I think).  Video games often run at 60 frames per second or more.  The faster the frame rate, the smoother it is. 

But that has nothing to do with syncing with music.  If you have a single ILDA file that is supposed to be synced with music you can set the frame rate to anything in Spaghetti.  Just set the ILDA source to time based and stretch the ILDA file start and end at the right time and it will sync up like it should.  If the frame rate you specified is too slow then frames will be skipped.  If your frame rate is high then frames will be repeated.

If you know the exact frame rate that the ILDA file should be played at then you can specify that in the project and set the ILDA source to Frame Based and it will be correct without any stretching.  You just have to adjust the start time to be correct.

[Fanny Pack]

To answer your question of what frame rate I use...

If I am porting a show from Mamba or using an existing show in ILDA file format I will try to match the frame rate with the source.  A lot of times Mamba shows are created at 25fps.  If it is just a show in ILDA format I'll try to divide the number of frames by the length of the song (in seconds) and then round the answer.  If all else fails I'll just set it to something close and use Time Based mode and stretch/shrink it to make it correct.

If I create a show from scratch I will most likely leave it at the default of 30.  If I am going to do a beam show with simple shapes that don't have a lot of points I will bump it up to maybe 50.  But, even at 25 the shows will look fine. 

Best thing to do is try if for yourself.  Create a simple show with different frame rates.  Then play it and see which looks the best.  You'll probably find that you can't tell much difference until you get the high or low extremes.

[BlinkenLights]

i was messing with frame rates today.. i have to say i like the way that spaghetti gives you options...

stretching a series of frames and then changing it from time mode to frame mode and morph, all give you different effects

there is still a blanking issue with morph

[Fanny Pack]

What is the isssue?

[BlinkenLights]

well when you take a starfield simulation and morph it, it ends up with lines in it.

[Fanny Pack]

Each star is made up of several points that are at the same place.  As the frame is morphed those points move to different locations.  Since they are all connected you see the lines between them.  You then see the lines fade or or new lines being fading in as all the points converge to new stars.  And finally the lines should disappear and you will be left with a new set of stars.

I assume you that expected to see the stars move to new locations?  That would be a cool visual effect.  It would take a more specialized morph to do that so that all of the points that are on top of each other are kept together.

I'll put that on the list to think about but I probably won't get to it soon.  In the mean time you will need to think of a different way to get the effect you were planning.  It wouldn't be hard to come up with a quick utility that takes a series of start and end points and then creates a bunch of stars that move as you intend.  That would be a good effect for LaserBoy.